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	<title>Comments on: On the Austrian Theory of the Trade Cycle, Part II</title>
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	<link>http://www.thefreemanonline.org/columns/thoughts-on-freedom/on-the-austrian-theory-of-the-trade-cycle-part-ii/</link>
	<description>Ideas on Liberty</description>
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		<title>By: Craig T</title>
		<link>http://www.thefreemanonline.org/columns/thoughts-on-freedom/on-the-austrian-theory-of-the-trade-cycle-part-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-44270</link>
		<dc:creator>Craig T</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Jun 2011 22:31:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thefreemanonline.org/?p=8940#comment-44270</guid>
		<description>Everyday evidence of greater prosperity—better cars, faster microchips, greater varieties of offerings in supermarkets, less-expensive and higher-quality clothing— combined with the long period (nearly 30 years) over which such evidence built up, convinced me that this prosperity was real. It was no illusion.&quot;

This is a natural process of the evoltuion of the increasing economy of scale, what Buckminster Fuller coined as ephemeralization. The author confuses several things here and that is the soruce of his issues. The natural tendency ofthe free market to cause natural deflation is an issue many economists ignore.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Everyday evidence of greater prosperity—better cars, faster microchips, greater varieties of offerings in supermarkets, less-expensive and higher-quality clothing— combined with the long period (nearly 30 years) over which such evidence built up, convinced me that this prosperity was real. It was no illusion.&#8221;</p>
<p>This is a natural process of the evoltuion of the increasing economy of scale, what Buckminster Fuller coined as ephemeralization. The author confuses several things here and that is the soruce of his issues. The natural tendency ofthe free market to cause natural deflation is an issue many economists ignore.</p>
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		<title>By: Roger McKinney</title>
		<link>http://www.thefreemanonline.org/columns/thoughts-on-freedom/on-the-austrian-theory-of-the-trade-cycle-part-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-8475</link>
		<dc:creator>Roger McKinney</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Apr 2009 19:07:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thefreemanonline.org/?p=8940#comment-8475</guid>
		<description>PS, I just remembered that in “Monetary Theory and Trade Cycles” Hayek asked if the boom/bust cycle does more harm than good and he answered no. In spite of the damage done, he thought the process was a net positive. I believe he wrote that technological progress was greater with the booms/busts than it would have been under a gold standard. So the ABCT doesn’t necessarily mean that business cycles make us poorer. He was also pessimistic about ending them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>PS, I just remembered that in “Monetary Theory and Trade Cycles” Hayek asked if the boom/bust cycle does more harm than good and he answered no. In spite of the damage done, he thought the process was a net positive. I believe he wrote that technological progress was greater with the booms/busts than it would have been under a gold standard. So the ABCT doesn’t necessarily mean that business cycles make us poorer. He was also pessimistic about ending them.</p>
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		<title>By: Roger McKinney</title>
		<link>http://www.thefreemanonline.org/columns/thoughts-on-freedom/on-the-austrian-theory-of-the-trade-cycle-part-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-8472</link>
		<dc:creator>Roger McKinney</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Apr 2009 18:52:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thefreemanonline.org/?p=8940#comment-8472</guid>
		<description>In “Profits, Interest and Investments” Hayek creates a business cycle without a change in interest rates. He concludes that interest rates are not as powerful as profits in guiding the economy. But Hayek also got discouraged about the Ricardo Effect in the 70’s. He thought it would be stronger and work much sooner. It’s possible that we have unrealistic expectations about how long monetary expansion can occur before the Austrian cycle corrects it. I think some good econometric analyses of boom periods would be helpful in adjusting our expectations.

Also, it seems that the booms before 1981 led to consumer price inflation because the new money came through gov spending and went directly to purchase consumption goods. Booms after 1981 came from the Fed and as a result the new money went into assets instead of consumer goods, so inflation appeared in asset prices. It also went into higher order production. In the 1991 depression, the overinvestment was primarily in fiber optic cable. After the bust, cable sold for 10 cents on the dollar. 

As complex and powerful as the ABCT is, we tend to forget that the economy is still more complex. Productivity enhancements thwart the effects of monetary pumping. The Feds stop and start monetary pumping. Rolling recessions in different industries and in different parts of the country occur between depressions. It seems to me that the “vigilance” of the Fed cuts short major corrections of malinvestments and pushes them off a few years. It seems we have several small depressions as the Fed puts off the real correction until one day the major correction happens. It’s sort of like earthquakes in that tremors precede the earthquake, or aftershocks follow it.

But if you look at average wages from the BLS, it’s clear that they have stagnated since 1973 and were only beginning to recover in 2000 when they plateaued. According to that measure, we have run very fast and hard for the past 30 years to remain in one place.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In “Profits, Interest and Investments” Hayek creates a business cycle without a change in interest rates. He concludes that interest rates are not as powerful as profits in guiding the economy. But Hayek also got discouraged about the Ricardo Effect in the 70’s. He thought it would be stronger and work much sooner. It’s possible that we have unrealistic expectations about how long monetary expansion can occur before the Austrian cycle corrects it. I think some good econometric analyses of boom periods would be helpful in adjusting our expectations.</p>
<p>Also, it seems that the booms before 1981 led to consumer price inflation because the new money came through gov spending and went directly to purchase consumption goods. Booms after 1981 came from the Fed and as a result the new money went into assets instead of consumer goods, so inflation appeared in asset prices. It also went into higher order production. In the 1991 depression, the overinvestment was primarily in fiber optic cable. After the bust, cable sold for 10 cents on the dollar. </p>
<p>As complex and powerful as the ABCT is, we tend to forget that the economy is still more complex. Productivity enhancements thwart the effects of monetary pumping. The Feds stop and start monetary pumping. Rolling recessions in different industries and in different parts of the country occur between depressions. It seems to me that the “vigilance” of the Fed cuts short major corrections of malinvestments and pushes them off a few years. It seems we have several small depressions as the Fed puts off the real correction until one day the major correction happens. It’s sort of like earthquakes in that tremors precede the earthquake, or aftershocks follow it.</p>
<p>But if you look at average wages from the BLS, it’s clear that they have stagnated since 1973 and were only beginning to recover in 2000 when they plateaued. According to that measure, we have run very fast and hard for the past 30 years to remain in one place.</p>
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		<title>By: Vincent Patsy</title>
		<link>http://www.thefreemanonline.org/columns/thoughts-on-freedom/on-the-austrian-theory-of-the-trade-cycle-part-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-8461</link>
		<dc:creator>Vincent Patsy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Apr 2009 15:01:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thefreemanonline.org/?p=8940#comment-8461</guid>
		<description>Mike, excessive money creation caused speculation in Western states during the Panic of 1819, not in the eastern states. Once the speculative ball starts rolling, more people enter the market to speculate in that market. Most people with money do not want to live in downtown Detroit (I am from Michigan) so the bubble took place in Metro Detroit.

The reason why you can never predict when and where bubbles takes place is because economics is dependent on human beings who have free will. There is no possible way to quantify, and therefore predict, where people will choose to speculate.

As for the 1980s and 1990s, there are reasons why we did not notice, or did not explode the bubble sooner is related to inflation. When the government creates new money, it prices do not rise immediately. People hold \\&quot;cash balances\\&quot; in order to facilitate transactions. When the believe prices are going to drop, they build up their cash balances and thus draw money out of circulation. This causes a lowering in prices to a new equilibrium level. Then with prices lower the begin spending again. 

If people expect prices to rise, they begin to draw down their \\&quot;cash balances,\\&quot; and this is the second stage of inflation. This takes time and in our own history, it took until the late 60s for people to realize that prices were not going down. Once this happens the public spends the money because government can print it to take resources away from them. Once it starts, it is difficult to stop inflation (at least politically).

During the 1980s and 1990s inflation was lower. The possible reasons why are as follows: cheap goods from China, dollar outflows for hyperinflating countries, Paul Volcker and the 21% Fed Funds Rate, and the tried and true governmental solution, redefining inflation as to make it lower. All of these factors caused more confidence in the dollar, and so the inflation was not noticed (like the 1920s) but the malinvestments were still being made.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mike, excessive money creation caused speculation in Western states during the Panic of 1819, not in the eastern states. Once the speculative ball starts rolling, more people enter the market to speculate in that market. Most people with money do not want to live in downtown Detroit (I am from Michigan) so the bubble took place in Metro Detroit.</p>
<p>The reason why you can never predict when and where bubbles takes place is because economics is dependent on human beings who have free will. There is no possible way to quantify, and therefore predict, where people will choose to speculate.</p>
<p>As for the 1980s and 1990s, there are reasons why we did not notice, or did not explode the bubble sooner is related to inflation. When the government creates new money, it prices do not rise immediately. People hold \\&amp;quot;cash balances\\&amp;quot; in order to facilitate transactions. When the believe prices are going to drop, they build up their cash balances and thus draw money out of circulation. This causes a lowering in prices to a new equilibrium level. Then with prices lower the begin spending again. </p>
<p>If people expect prices to rise, they begin to draw down their \\&amp;quot;cash balances,\\&amp;quot; and this is the second stage of inflation. This takes time and in our own history, it took until the late 60s for people to realize that prices were not going down. Once this happens the public spends the money because government can print it to take resources away from them. Once it starts, it is difficult to stop inflation (at least politically).</p>
<p>During the 1980s and 1990s inflation was lower. The possible reasons why are as follows: cheap goods from China, dollar outflows for hyperinflating countries, Paul Volcker and the 21% Fed Funds Rate, and the tried and true governmental solution, redefining inflation as to make it lower. All of these factors caused more confidence in the dollar, and so the inflation was not noticed (like the 1920s) but the malinvestments were still being made.</p>
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		<title>By: Stephen Grossman</title>
		<link>http://www.thefreemanonline.org/columns/thoughts-on-freedom/on-the-austrian-theory-of-the-trade-cycle-part-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-7414</link>
		<dc:creator>Stephen Grossman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Apr 2009 00:09:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thefreemanonline.org/?p=8940#comment-7414</guid>
		<description>Ayn Rand said that there is no systematic study of the effects of govt on US economic history. We have parts, but not the whole. Perhaps the computer revolution and increasing global trade hid the effects of inflation for a while.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ayn Rand said that there is no systematic study of the effects of govt on US economic history. We have parts, but not the whole. Perhaps the computer revolution and increasing global trade hid the effects of inflation for a while.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Rulle</title>
		<link>http://www.thefreemanonline.org/columns/thoughts-on-freedom/on-the-austrian-theory-of-the-trade-cycle-part-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-7384</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Rulle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 20:20:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thefreemanonline.org/?p=8940#comment-7384</guid>
		<description>Question:

Any particular reason why the real estate bubble and subsequent crash (peak \&quot;bubble\&quot; measured as housing value divided by median family income eg) revealed itself predominantly in California, Nevada, Phoenix, and Florida---particularly California? How is that consistent with the excess credit argument? Shouldn\&#039;t the result have been more spread out?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Question:</p>
<p>Any particular reason why the real estate bubble and subsequent crash (peak \&quot;bubble\&quot; measured as housing value divided by median family income eg) revealed itself predominantly in California, Nevada, Phoenix, and Florida&#8212;particularly California? How is that consistent with the excess credit argument? Shouldn\&#8217;t the result have been more spread out?</p>
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